Need urgent help with DVD Creation

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Forever On Film
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Joined: Apr 22 2004

Hi guys,

I have recently had a few wedding DVDs returned with customers saying that they stick and jump throughout.

I know there is a possible compatibility problem, but most of them have tried them out on different players and the same thing happens. And what with the number of returns it is obviously a problem with the way I create my discs.

I am someone who is self-taught on computers and as long as things work I am fine, but when something goes wrong I am stumped and don't know what to try. DVD creation has always been a bone of contention with me, as there are so many factors that may be the thing I am doing wrong, so if I run through my process perhaps any of you kind fellow videographers could give me some advice?

I edit using adobe premiere 6.5/pinnacle dv500dvd. When the project is completed I create an Mpeg within Premiere using the Export Timeline command, changing the preset to Pinnacle DVD PAL. This creates an MPEG of the project.

I have found though that sometimes if the project is over 90 minutes I have to configure the video settings before creating the mpeg - changing the variable bit rate to between 4 and 6 instead of 6 and 8 - would this affect anything at all?

I am aware that many other people can fit up to 2 hours onto one dvd disc, but I have never been able to create a disc much longer than 90 minutes, without having to split across onto a second disc - what am I doing wrong here?

I then use Sonic's My DVD 2.3 to create my DVDs. I am aware that this is not the most sophisticated piece of software, but it has been easy to use, and I have not had time to look into different software. In My DVD, I create a menu screen and then place the Mpeg on the play button and create separate chapter points.

I then burn my DVD onto Verbatim 4x DVD-R Advanced AZO DVD Discs, using a new Pioneer DVR-107 drive.

Originally I was using a Pioneer 103 drive, which I recently replaced as I suspected this may be the problem, and for a while the new drive rectified the problem for some customers, however the same faults are now being reported so I don't think it can be the drive.

There are so many factors that could cause something to go wrong, but I need help pinpointing the problem. Is it the way I encode my mpegs, is it the dvd creation software I use, the discs, the drive? or is DVD-R technology just really incompatible with that many players?

I feel that creating DVDs should be a lot easier than I have found it, and feel there is something I am just doing wrong. Have you guys all found it easy to set up doing DVDs? If so what do you do? Please feel free to run me through the whole process. Is there a wonderful piece of equipment I should invest to help create a full-proof system. That is what I need, a system that I can rely on to work evey time.

As I say I am not very technically-minded, so detailed help and simple language would be appreciated

Here's hoping you can help!

Best Wishes
Katie

mooblie
mooblie's picture
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Joined: Apr 27 2001

Have you noticed that the DVDs created at lower bit rates (4-6 Mbps) are better (more likely to be compatible) than the higher bitrate (6-8 Mbps) ones?

I tend never to go above 6 as a rule.

Also: Are you using AC3 format for audio (rather than .aif or .wav)? This help maximise compatibility too.

Martin - DVdoctor in moderation. Everyone is entitled to my opinion.

Paul D
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Joined: Nov 23 2000

I recently read a DVD authoring company recommending that you don't go above 6.5 Mbps (including audio) if you want to avoid problems with stuttering. What software are you using to burn the discs?

It might be helpful if you quantified the problem level a bit - are we talking 10 or more customers? and what percentage of the DVDs you produce give problems? We have burnt a lot of DVD-Rs and have had very few "compatability" problems and these have been with either Phillips players or very cheap ones.

Forever On Film
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Joined: Apr 22 2004

Hi Moobile,

It tends to be the weddings that are over 90 minutes that are less compatible, when I have had to reduce the bit rate to around 4-6.

I was under the impression that I was reducing the quality of the DVD doing this - but is it actually better for the DVD to reduce the bitrate?

When I create the mpeg, premiere automatically produces a .wav file for the audio, can I / should I change this to an AC3 (don't know what this is? another type of file format?)

Thanks
Katie

Forever On Film
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Joined: Apr 22 2004

Hi Paul D,

I am using My DVD 2.3 to burn my discs.

I would say about 10% of customers have complained of this stuttering. As you say you have had very few compatibility problems, which I imagine most people would say the same, so I would like to try and pinpoint what I am doing wrong.

Thanks
Katie

baz1
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Joined: Oct 22 2002

On the subject of DVD IT it works great for me
But does anybody now why after writing two discs
It gets an unknown error!!! Thanks Barry.

stoo
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Joined: May 28 2001

how are you burning the disks?.
I burn at 4x but Ive herd from other people that they only burn at 1x?.
I had a problem with some of my disks becuse I was bruning them using udf in nero. I now use dvd video setting in nero and have no problems.
hop this helps

Forever On Film
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Joined: Apr 22 2004

I am burning my discs using my DVD 2.3. I create the disc within that program and then select the create disc function - then it burns it - is that not right?

Katie

Paul D
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Joined: Nov 23 2000

As I understand it a minority of DVD players (presumably cost-cutting cheaper ones) have problems keeping up with higher data rates (above about 6.5 Mbps) and the result is stuttering. So you should have fewer problems if you keep the data rate at or below 6.5 Mbps.

My first suggestion would be to try using a different burning program - I use Nero 6 (avoid 5). That may help, but this is a frustrating area!

Forever On Film
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Joined: Apr 22 2004

Is nero 6 easy to use? does it allow you to create your own menu screens and buttons?

Barry Hunter
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Joined: Nov 30 2001

I don`t have any problems copying my DVD`s using Nero 5 but this is a "Burning" app, not an authoring one!

Barry Hunter videos4all.org

Paul D
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Joined: Nov 23 2000

Yes Barry's correct what I was suggesting was that having authored your files with MyDVD, you then point Nero at the video folder or disc image (sorry I've never used MyDVD and don't know how it works) and get Nero to burn it to disc.

Basically your burner and discs are good quality, you're saying these problems still occur with lower data rate discs, so it's a case of altering something else in the chain and seeing if that makes a difference.

Forever On Film
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Joined: Apr 22 2004

Oh I see. I have nero 6 burning rom - is that the right application? If so How do I open up my DVD IT file (which is what My DVD saves it as) as a project that I can then burn.

If you have time step by step instructions would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Katie

busbyvideo
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Joined: Feb 7 2002

If you can, save your DVDIT project as a dvd folder on the hard drive, then use nero to burn the files onto the dvd disk.

If you want a no-brainer dvd, try a stand-alone burner from Philips or Panasonic etc.

Mike

Fabian
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Joined: Sep 4 2000

Do you put labels on your DVD's ?

The only 'stuttering' I experienced was on discs that had labels printed and put on them. I guess that these were slightly misplaced on the discs therefore throwing the balance of the spinning disc off slightly during playback.

I over came this problem by recording to printable discs and printing direct to these.

That's just my 2p's worth. Hope it helps.

Fabian Murphy, murphyvideoservices.com

dhphy
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Joined: Nov 3 2000

Katie
I use premiere 6 and the pinnacle DVD setting, but I change the default audio setting to compressed audio at 190 or something like that.
Its the same compression as used in the VCD pinnacle setting.The default WAV files are too big.
So far, never had a returned disc.
I am still using a Pioneer 103, although I have a 107, this doesn't seem to be supported by impression, the authoring and burning software I use.
However, I alwys burn at 1x although the 103 only supports up to 2x anyway. Also I use inkjet printable Verbatims. Never use lables
It sounds to me that you are doing everything OK.
I'd suggest trying a one hour project at Pinnacle DVD presets authored and burnt at 1x, no lable.
Then try the same project at a bit rate that would allow the same projct to fit on a DVD if it were 2 hours.
That might at least eliminate or identify the encoding as the problem.
Dave

Goldeneye
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Joined: Apr 19 2004

Hi katie,

I have had exactly the same problem as you recently. In fact I also built my own PC and use Premier 6.5 and Pinnacle DV500DVD. The only difference, is that I use is Adobe Encore to author the MPG2 files imported from Premier. I tried burning at a lot of different settings, and used several different blank DVD types. Usually I use the same Verbattim discs as yourself, but on a 90 minute project, I was also getting stutters on some DVD players. This was becoming a problem with a particular customer recently, so my brother advised me to go to Richer sounds and buy a blank TDK DVD disk in the plus format and burn it onto that. I usually burn in minus format, but thought I would try the change of tact. I also kept my bit rate settings at about 6, and burned it off in encore at CBR (constant bit rate) setting instead of VBR (variable bit rate which is what I ususally use). This seemed to do the trick for me, and if I have to deal with projects this size again, then I'll probably do the same, but like yourself, I'm also very frustrated that there seems to be so many variables in the whole process and no sure-fire way of tackling the problem. If you come across a better solution,
then please let us know

PP
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Joined: Jan 30 2004

If I was you I would take BusbyVideos suggestion and use a standalone DVD burner. I've been using the Panasonic for two years now (E20) with no discs coming back.

Alright, the menus are a bit simple, just one line titles, but no one has come back to me complaining about them. You can sometimes be your own worst enemy, trying to make the intro menus "all singing and all dancing" with animated backgrounds etc., but in reality all your customer wants is to navigate to the relevant part of the disc, so they're not really bothered.

I use the "two hour" setting and if my wedding videos are more than two hours, I put them on to two discs.

The machine converts them in realtime so it does save a lot of time and the results are very good.

PP

Peter

Barry Hunter
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Joined: Nov 30 2001

Do your self a favour & get LE!

Authoring is a doddle.

Barry Hunter videos4all.org

encore
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Joined: Mar 25 2004

Hi Katie

Here are some of the points I tend to stick to with all dvd's and I don't get any problems. Except one this week but it was their machine not my DVD.

I use Adobe Premiere 6.0 export video from timeline to MPEG2 at CBR(Constant bit rate) at either 4 6 or 7. Never any higher then 7 and don't use VBR unless you have an extreme amount of special effects using in your video.

The wav file must always be converted to AC3, never put wav file on a DVD cause this causes problems with DVD playback and is also a very large file to transfer to DVD.

We use 4 speed verbatim printable DVD discs and always, always write at 1x speed. It may take longer to write your disc but that's better than having to write another one.

I use SprueUp to create menus etc. and export out the VOB files and then burn using Nero 6.0.

Hope that helps

David James
Encore Productions

itisthebiz
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Joined: Jun 27 2004

I had a problem with stuttering on my own, very compatible DVD player from discs that I authored with impression using the Pinnacle DVD settings from Prem. It seemed to be worse when the audio started under black video then dissolved to the video.

I deduced that the bitrate was probably too low with VBR during the very simple intros, as when the images became more complex they were fine!

I changed to a CBR of 6000 and everything was happy!

I burn to Ritek GO4s with an A07 using Nero 6.

Tim

Forever On Film
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Joined: Apr 22 2004

Hi David (Encore Productions),

Thanks for your advice.

How do I convert the wav audio file into an ac3 file? Do I do this after Premiere has created a wav of the project or do I do it within premiere when I create the mpeg?

Also what software do you use to create your final DVD. I have encore 1.0 too, but have never learnt how to use it, but perhaps this is the way to go. Do I still import an mpeg into encore or leave encore to encode the files?

Thanks
Katie

bruise
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Joined: May 6 2004

I thought people advised VBR - now people are advising CBR. i'm confused...

mangoldwen
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Joined: May 5 2002

I do not know if I can be of any help but if you do not know what is an ac3 file, you will be better off buying a different application there are many around, otherwise you will be very confused and at same position as before.

By the way when you export the time line do you use software encoding? or hardware due to the fact the your card is capable of doing so.

Regards
Mango

johnfh
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Joined: Nov 5 2003

Hi folks another newbie using the same setup as Katie for editing (Premier 6 and DVD500). BUT when I moved to burning, I exported the timeline to a Pinnacle AVI then added the AVI to Nero Vision Express2 created chapters and burned successfully to a NEC 2500A. (-R)
Unfortunately the 1 hr 57 file had to be split into two as Nero refused to burn.
In my inexperience is this too simple or am I missing important steps.