HDV/DV deck

[bikergirl]

Hi,

Anyone know of the best standalone deck for playing back HDV tapes - and DV if poss?? Obviously we don't want to wear out the heads in Z1 so any ideas? AND where can we buy one (ex VAT)??

Cheers,

BG

[infocus]

Most obvious is the Sony HVR M10E - see http://www.sonybiz.net/images/product/E/HDV-CAM-VTR(brch).pdf .

From another post I gather you may be expecting other tapes from third parties, and in which case beware the two different types of HDV - HDV1 and HDV2. (720 and 1080 as far as I understand.) JVC make the BR HD50 HDV (see http://pro.jvc.com/pro/attributes/HDTV/brochure/ProHD-NTSC052705.pdf ), but note that it is HDV1 ONLY - and I don't think it will play back Z1 tapes, in spite of being "HDV". I don't know if there is any player which will handle HDV1 and HDV2, but can see a lot of customer confusion in the future. ;)

[bikergirl]

Cheers Infocus - good advice to know!

[cstv]

this could be a serious problem for a lot of people, especially considering that manufacturers don't seem to be labelling kit as one or the other. Both Sony and JVC's specs for their HDV camcorders and decks refer to HDV and either 1080 or 720. They don't mention HDV1 or HDV2. JVC do mention HDV1 and 2 in their "Highway" newsletter though. Understandably, neither side (particularly JVC coming in late) want to make too much noise about compatibility issues.

On the plus side, both JVC's and Sony's HDV decks will play back DV and DVCAM.

Hopefully someone will release a HDV1 and 2 playback device at some point, although that would be a tad annoying for the early adopters...

mark.

[mooblie]

....On the plus side, both JVC's and Sony's HDV decks will play back DV and DVCAM...

But it's "mini" sized tape case only right? (not full size?)

[bcrabtree]

But it's "mini" sized tape case only right? (not full size?)

Yup. And a bit like bikergirl's Sony Z1 in that respect.

;)


Bob C

[cstv]

so they'll both take full-sized tapes but will only play back DVCAM from mini tapes? the scoundrells!

[mooblie]

so they'll both take full-sized tapes ....

You've lost me. I thought they physically, mechanically, could only fit small tape shells in there????

[cstv]

i must admit, i was going purely on the size of the units and the previous specs of decks of this size... the "actual size" image in JVC's Highway newsletter looks a lot like the right size for a full-sized DV tape.

Looking at Sony's literature their deck looks like the case is designed to take full-sized tapes, but it only has a mini-sized mechanism... interesting... ;)

i think further investigation might be necessary... either way, i don't think i'll be buying an HDV deck until there's one that at least plays HDV1 and HDV2.

mark.

[hedleyw]

Unfortunately this only handles mini cassettes - a lot of money to pay on top of my DSR11 which I would need to keep for full size DVCam work.

Perhaps buying an FX1 to use as 2nd Cam / deck makes more economic sense if you're on a tight budget?

[PaulD]

Perhaps buying an FX1 to use as 2nd Cam / deck makes more economic sense if you're on a tight budget?
Hi
Since apparantly the same tape transport and head mechanism is common to both the FX1 and M10 tape deck, others are recommending the use of an FX1 - then you get a 2nd backup camera for your money.

[cstv]

why would anyone buy a deck if the mechanism is no different from that of a camcorder...? manufacturers really are trying it on these days!

mark.

[StevenBagley]

why would anyone buy a deck if the mechanism is no different from that of a camcorder...? manufacturers really are trying it on these days!

mark.

Because it looks like a deck and quacks like a deck. ;)

Personally, I much prefer using a deck with an NLE system over a camera because they just fit on the desk better and has connectivity on sensible connectors. The buttons are sensibly sized and located in a sensible place. In other words, the deck is designed to be used as a deck, while a camcorder isn't.

And if you are 'pro' it's much easier to squeeze a HVR-M10 into the rack with your other decks than an FX1.

Steven

[cstv]

And if you are 'pro' it's much easier to squeeze a HVR-M10 into the rack with your other decks than an FX1.

ah, but a FX1 isn't a "pro" camcorder, and neither is the Z1 really, if we're honest... ;)

i'm really not convinced that HDV - in the "professional" sense - is going to be around long enough to justify buying a deck. I can see that if you're DSR11/20/45 had just died AND you didn't use full-sized tapes then it might be worth it but you've still got the problem of only being able to play back HDV1 or HDV2 tapes, not both in the same box.

mark.

[infocus]

i'm really not convinced that HDV - in the "professional" sense - is going to be around long enough to justify buying a deck.
I think you have to ask what the alternative is. The only one at all in the offing at the moment is Panasonic P2 ProHD, and the forthcoming HVX200. That roughly needs 1GB per minute, and at the moment that's roughly a cost of £250/recorded minute. At the moment, to give you even an hour of operating time before a download, that's over £10,000 of media cost! Yes, P2, or a rival solid state system, will come down in price, but I would argue that on the basis of past trends the timescale is such that HDV will be around long enough to justify a deck purchase. Just as DV decks already in use now will continus to be used for a while yet, even after the introduction of HDV itself.

Even when the economics of P2 improve, there will remain the need to download for a long while longer. And in the meantime, the BACKWARDS compatability of HDV to DV is a powerful factor.

[cstv]

that's all true, and the backwards compatability oh HDV to DV would be even more powerful if the deck supported full-sized DV tapes. That's a situation where i wouldn't even be that adverse to the deck being chipped to prevent HDV recording on full-sized tapes. The other vital feature is the ability to play back (wouldn't have to record) HDV1 and HDV2.

I can see the advantages of an HDV deck, but the products available at the moment are just camcorders in a deck-shaped box.

[K O'Malley]

The JVC HD 50 will play both mini and standard dv/dv cam/ HDV 720 both sizes, and gives out sd, 720 and 1080i, croosconverting 720p to 1080i.

[infocus]

Will it also record onto the larger size cassettes in HDV mode? (Even if not, the compatability of being able to replay large big DVCAM tapes could be useful.) And are we correct in assuming it only replays HDV1, not HDV2? The ability to replay either would be very useful, if only record a single type.